I don’t believe in the “PK” sydrome. You know, the “pastor’s kid” nonsense. I don’t believe that the children of pastors are attacked by the devil at any rate higher than anyone else’s children.
Having said that, I do believe that pastors have a responsibility to lead their own children to a saving grace of Jesus Christ and to lead by the example they set in their own home. If a pastor, raising children in his/her own home, cannot live the type of life that their own children would want to emulate, then that’s not the type of pastor I would want to sit under. It’s not even scriptural, though I won’t start quoting scriptures here. Email me if you desire a scripture to back up the fact that if a church leader cannot control his own family, he has no business leading.
Anyway, Covina sent me a tip today. She led me to some information about one of the leading pastors in Cleveland, Ohio. His name is R.A. Vernon. I’d never heard of him to be honest with you. There is an MTV program called “Sweet Sixteen” which highlights the children of wealthy parents. It’s one of the saddest, most pathetic shows on t.v. Spoiled, ungrateful children turning sixteen who are “entitled”. Half of them probably cannot even add 6 + 15, much less multiply or divide, yet they are profiling at their silly parents’ expense. It’s obscene.
Never would you expect for a pastor to allow his children such excess or to broadcast it on television. Yet. Pastor R.A.Vernon allowed his daughter to have a “rock and roll” themed party. Viewing the video, one cannot help but wonder whether or not this young lady is even saved. Her whole life appears wrapped around her father’s money.
I blame the church members in Cleveland for financing R.A. Vernon’s lifestyle. One in which at one point he would fly his helicopter from one side of town to the other as he visited his two churches. He also owns an airplane. Again, it’s insanity at the expense of fleeced flocks.
PRESS HERE for the video
And PRESS HERE for another article about this topic
Hat tip to Covina for story
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American Idol
Tiger Woods
I want to say this as gently as I can.
SHES A STUCK UP LITTLE BRAT!!! Does her father even read the parts of the Bible about being humble and content?
Her only excuse for having a huge party was so her friends could see her, she expected everything to cater to her wants, and she is incrediablly VAIN.
Its hard to believe this PASTOR allowed his daughters stuck up attitude to be shown on T.V.(let alone MTV). He hasnt instructed her anything about hard work and dedication. Even the dance instructor called her Lazy. If that were my daughter I would be imbarrassed, and ashamed.
But after watching the end of the program, (I see she got EVERYTHING SHE WANTED AND MORE)I see that he just feeds into her bad behavior. I havnt heard of R.A Vernon before, but my first impression of him isnt that high.
Cop I feel so sorry for these parents. They are leading their daughter (and themselves) to satan and don’t care because they don’t want to upset their ‘princess’. She needs a lesson in how a true woman of God is supposed to act because her parents dropped the ball on that one. But first she needs to have a trip to the back of the ‘woodshed’ if you know what I mean.
Lynn,
Please allow me a moment of extreme sarcasm. Now, now sister Lynn. She is the child of a god (the god of self). Why should only Paris Hilton or Britney spears be allowed to show off their wealth? Why can’t she show how a ’saved, sanctified’ young ‘lady’ can PAAARTY? Why can’t she ’shake it like it’s hot’ with the other girls letting boys rub their bodies all over them? So what if the widow’s tithe is being used to pay for this ‘party’. Don’t you know you are not supposed to question what the mand of gawd does or how he raises his children. Come on now, get with the program. This is a new day, a new gospel. The old things are passed away like modesty and humility. I was hoping to make you laugh but this is just so sad.
So sad, but people will be held accountable for their actions. God is a jealous God…
I’ve talked about this on my blog and I couldn’t get past the first 6 minutes. I was disgusted. Also, I was given info that this pastor was “blessed” with a luxury car (beemer or benzo) from the church.
Someone came to defend him on my blog and he/she (the tone is male) says basically, for those who disagreed, have poverty mentality.
All of you sound just like those who complained about the woman with the Alabaster box anointing Jesus saying what a waste and that this could have been given to the poor. (See Mark Chapter 14:3-11) Stop hating when people of God are blessed. People like to say that it is lifestyles like those of mega pastors, is why people don ’t come to church. But I see and talk with many more people who don’t come to church because most of the church folk they know have a poverty mindset and are not walking in any blessing so their question is if I am doing much better than you without God why should I give my life to him and become pitiful and poor like church folk. What we really see happening is people are leaving all of the poor little churches that have been preaching that God’s blesses but there is no manifestation in their life or ministry and flocking to where God is blessing and life is evident.
I believe this person has been to several blogs on this subject bcuz he def has his info mixd up…says I accused pastor of stealing and dogged out his child…(i only watched 6 horrid minutes)
What I do know about Pastor Vernon through family in Cleveland is that He personally owns and/or operates the following business.
The Largest Roller Skating Rink in Northeastern Ohio
A Sport Complex that rents out facilities to youth leagues within the city
A Restaurant
A Book Store
A production company which released and award winning Praise and Worship CD and his somewhat autobiographical book, The Blessing behind Closed doors
An apartment building and other real estate
A small construction company
A snow removal and lawn care service
All of this provides jobs to hundreds of people and yes puts quite a bit of money in his pocket. I guess this is his version of tent sales. I also understand that he gives a whole lot to the community through providing food for the hungry, adopting several schools in Cleveland where they purchased books and sport equipment and sports uniforms. Each year they give away thousand of book bags each full of book supplies and list goes on. And in a city that has been dead spiritualy he has helped thousands give their life to the Lord. He has preached in jail and prisions. But none of this gets mentioned in these types of forums.
Did his daughter make a comment or two that seemed bratty, well yes but she is a child and when she made the comments she was corrected by her parents after making them. But the post failed to mention that fact. If you watch any of the other sweet sixteen and see the huge difference in her attitude and theirs. Also all of the other children got BMW ’s and such. She got three scooters. Come on. At Sixteen I wanted a Car not a scooter. He (seems male)totally misses the point.
edit as u see fit. I responded…he posted thrice times already. I’ve given the person the option to not come to my blog or start their own…but we’re not going to keep going over pastor vernon and fam…the truth hurts.
Sigh! Once this show aired, I knew it was only a matter of time before some “PK” appeared and I was right. This girl is like this because of the parents they overindulge her and she will forever have this mentality.
@ Yvette – Sarcasm always allowed and welcome (LOL)
@ Cop – I agree – She’s a brat and I blame her parents
@ Regina – WELCOME to Hicktown!
@ Bria – I see I’m not the only one who gets visits from these confused folks!
@ Diva – Yes, of course the Christian community would have to involve themselves in that mess
I think it is very sad that people have so much time to worry about my Pastor and his family. I have been a memeber for 3 years and I know what this man is about, all yall want to talk about is what he has, where it comes from, why is his daughter on Sweet 16….NUN of UR Business I would say, if you don’t like it why watch? She is a 16 year old and he is a man Pastor is his occupation if he was a young black lawyer no one would care, if she told her mother to go to hell you would love it. I say get some christ in your lives and worry bout the things you can control, because all this hate couldn’t possibly be healthy in God’s eyes…If Pastor Vernon is lacking integrity in any way it is not up to you to say so he will have to answer to GOD but don’t forget you have to answer too…I thought it said touch not his annointed???? this man has done nothin wrong so we should be careful when we judge others especially men and women of GOD…Read the Bible, Go to work DO SOMETHIN!!!! Catch my pastor on the Word Network or channel 43 everyday 7:30….LORD knows you need it….PEople talked about Jesus Christ… THis man must be GREAT!! and please remember…..We at the Word CHurch only worry if you not talkin!! K?
Imagezeverything,
I noticed that you capitalized the ‘P’ in pastor but used a lower case for the ‘C’ in Christ. My point is, be careful that you don’t worship any man. Save your reverence for the Messiah. I never saw this particular Sweet Sixteen episode. From what I am reading, the young lady did not carry herself in a Christian manner. I am also concluding that most people took offense to a man of God allowing his child to be on such a worldly television show in the first place. Where is the distinction between how people in the world behave versus those of the Church?? You are correct that people talked about Jesus Christ (still do), but if your pastor decides to allow his family to parade in front of television cameras, he too can expect to be talked about and put on blast!
IT is called a typo ms love… I worship no man only Christ removing myself as a member of his church I do not see anything wrong with what they were trying to do, that is to show that the child of a pastor can too have fun. I dont feel she did anything that wasnt christ like i mean if your father is a preacher does that mean no parties, no dancing no laughter? I think what was meant to be sumthin positive to be shown to other teens has been blown way out of proportion… I beieve everyone watch the show and as soon as they heard Pastor then they looked for everything wrong. When she said anything remotely out of line moms put her in her place do we think that pastors children dont act up? if anythig it allowed me to see my 16 year old is normal or that his is normal maybe. If she had been on there at church payin close attention to he word and the show was all about him lord have mercy… the nation would probably be in the street turnin cars over lol. I am not defendin this man because i worship him im defending him as a parent if i could put my child on sweet 16 i probably would a single parent who wanted to give her child a once in a life time more than likely couldnt afford to but it made my baby smile…that feelin right there is what has caused all this hoopla he didnt want her to do it at first but his baby wanted this. Dont dog him as a pastor think of him as a daddy. Until this man preaches anything i can not find in the bible myself he is fine by me he teaches me very well how to strenghthen my relationship with God and he also stresses it is not about him when he brings forth the word it is God that has a word for you not ra (please take notice im not persistant with my shift key)maybe he shouldnt have done it but he did get over it there is always gonna be those that love it and those that hate it you feel me? even when the kids got to dancin provocative it was quickly corrected but she never once got provocative we are way too into what is wrong with pastors in large churches. I’m listening to him as we speak the party was 25,000 of his money just like what your parents used to tell you how much i make or spend. its just sad to me we will diagree all day thats the way the cookie crumbles. thank you for your comment i truly appreciate you.
oops your parents used to tell you how much they make or spend is not your bizness. lol this thing types really funny leaves out lots of letters if you are not careful…is it my computer?lol.
why is his daughter on Sweet 16….NUN of UR Business I would say,
Welcome to HickTown, Imagezeverything. I see you found your way over here. Good for you. Let me explain something to you. The purpose of blogging is to share your views and opinions. Every topic is fair game, including your pastor and his family.
YES, it is my business because when he blasted that garbage onto national t.v., he made it my business.
Again, welcome to HickTown.
Lynn
THanks for the welcome. I do understand what a blog is for im not tryin to change anyones mind including yours it is clearly how I feel i am over the incident I have nothing else to say i feel the way I feel its no prob…Please coninue to pray for our church and our pastor so that we will have continued blessings. Saving souls is the soul mission of the Word Church and isnt that what is truly important? THank you so much and again thanks for the warm welome as I do intend to check you out on more than just this issue…K? Love YOU!! B-BYE!
You are welcome to disagree with us, Imagezeverthing but by the same token, be aware that this is not a blog for the faint at heart. We come strong here. Hope you can hang in here with us. You’ll find the HickTown community a very loving and welcoming one with all types of belief systems, etc.
Lynn
I found it disgusting as a Christian. He had no business putting his family on that show. How is this aiding to the body of Christ?
I have never supported the word church because I feel that what Vernon is preaching is just that, “his” word. He is not biblical, he hits some emotional cords and that just it. He’s nothing more than a sugar pill.
I grew up in the same district as Vernon, I remember him as a young preacher and people questioned his motives then. If you buy into the “they locked the doors on me because the church was growing too fast” line then your a fool. There’s a whole lot more to that story than that.
And no offense, but if you were not there then don’t try to “straigthen me out” People have questioned his motives for years – even down to him going from church to church offering money to choir members and people to play music for his church and to leave theirs. Again, if you don’t know nothin about that, then please don’t comment. I am not talking anything I don’t know first hand. I still remember being on the near west side and he came to the church to talk with the piano player, the pastor of the church clearly announced who he was and this man could care less that there was a service going on.
God has not blessed that church, that man has worked day and night to make sure that that church grew. Those are business deals, not blessings.
I remember being a deacon and having to pray over him and another pastor because he came into their church and tried to take over- taking about “God tole me to take this thing over” – again, I was there.
So no, I think that this MTV show only demonstrates what folks have know for years about him.
Welcome to HickTown, Nnod and thanks for your insight.
Lynn
Thanks, I know that at first it looks like “hating” but this is the word of God, you can’t be playing with it.
Hi Lynn and all,
I found your blog, by way of Independent Conservative’s blog. I have been checking out your site and enjoy the atmosphere and the discourse. I just wanted to drop a comment on the subject at hand. It’s really a shame that with all this young lady (and I am using the term ‘lady’ loosely) learns about prosperity from her dad, she is, apparently not being taught about the Prov 31:10-31 characteristics. We won’t even touch the subject of rock music and all of the demonic spirits that are involved (oops, did I just go there?). There’s nothing wrong with having money, but it’s about the attitude that you possess toward that money and how you carry yourself that really matters. She comes off as pretentious, vain and devoid of logistical comprehension (reference: She wanted “her” plane to land in front of the building!!)
Welcome to HickTown, 2thehilt!
Lynn
It seems to me that a lot of these comments are from experts on knowing right from wrong. Yes Pastor Vernon did allow his daughter to have the party very reluctantly and maybe if he knew that MTV would highlight the things that they did he may have not allowed the whole thing. It is a judgement call. His heart was in the right place especially in raising, for a daughter that he did not father. He is allowed to make mistakes as if this is one. Yes he has money but no one is questioning T.D. Jakes about his money. Pastor has several businesses and as if it is any of your business he does not really on the tihes and offerings soley for his salary. should he be attacked for not living in the projects anymore or working part time at KFC. No. this blog is not about his daughter, let’s be real. This is an attack on a Pastors that does far more good for the community than the misteps. He is human. If you’ve actually watched the Sweet 16 show, just look at the expression of him and his wife. It tells it all. He is not just a pastor but a father. The have family issues just like everyone else. Which one of you have not made any mistakes or bad choices. I’d like to see your homes. Let he or she who is without sin cast the first stone. No one can read the hearts an motive of a man. Even the angels dare not judge satan because it is not their place. If Pastor Vernon has done any wrong, he will answer to God.
M.C., thanks for visiting HickTown and for sharing your opinions. ALL opinions are welcome here!
Lynn
Bravo on Pastor Vernon’s personal accomplishments and on the good deeds that you all are reporting that he does. He STILL shoulda kept his daughter off of MTV!! That opinion is not meant to erase the man’s good qualities. How about showcasing her on TBN in some spiritual capacity??
Oh yeah, and one more thing. No one is talking about T.D. Jakes because he didn’t hop on MTV and throw ANY of his kids a Super Sweet Sixteen Brat’s Bash!
HAppy SUnday!!! I entered my opinion the other day and I did so at a very angry moment i till feel i kept it sweet, but who isn’t upset when someone attacks their family??? I am only here today to add a few thoughts and respond to the comment MC and lynn left…. To MC I know you have to be a fellow member thank you for what you posted it made many valid points and i agree with you very much so as i am sure everyone on here can relate to the things you’ve stated no matter their view, I’ve seen other blogs where people have began to talk about thisbaby and it saddens my heart because i have a 14 and 16 year old of my own and I can only pray that she isnt feeling all this is her fault had she not asked for this party. I also wanted to add now that I am in a far better place than a few days ago, to no one in particular does anyone wonder why everyone focused on every thing that was done wrong in this show? i havent seen very many people say that ooh that young lady got flip at the tongue and her mom did say something and not just look at her as many of the parents do, no one has said they were dancin nasty and chanae noticed and IMIDIATELY someone grabbed a mic and told them to keep it clean? and the other thing many have attacked sayin he could have rehabed homes, donated to the needy in his city, or donated thousands to a food pantry… (sorry for the lengthyness) I just want to say proudly not boastfully as a tither we give massive support throughout the city to the young old homeless incarcerated former addicts ex cons the abused and this list give or take a few is growing.. we own a safehouse for women in transition to keep them safe with their children with all brand new household items for them so they can get away from abusers, get the word of God and transition back into society productively, their are properties, and we have a clothing and food pantry where anyone in need not just members can come and getsome food or something to wear ANYone and more…. to see a plan set forth, a vision and watch these things accomplished is rewarding to me because I am a part of all this as a tither there is so much more to our church and pastor than this party..we have a new plan for 08 and i am excited to see this come to past as well…Although i feel they did nothing wrong no one is with out flaw Jesus is made righteous for us and did die on the cross for ALL of our sin!! last point before sayin hello to my girl lynn…. if he committed any sin surely he will answer to God i know that we judge according to what we SEE God judges according to what he knows which is your heart… and as we judge and condem remeber all sins are created equal lies, murder, stealing, and judging others no one greater than the other so if he could get punished by God for having a sweet 16 party or anything else done wrong if anything has been done, cant anyone who talks about him on any occasion in a negative manner also be punished in the same manner?? HEYYYYYYYYYYYYY LYNNNN… I just wanted to say that I appreciate your friendlyness in your response to MC thats what im talking about because you left me feeling that my views were only welcome if i agreed with the people hear maybe when we read we imagine things so i could be wrong but i just thought that you were tasteful in this response and wantedto share my opinion.. i love all people what would we learn if there wasnt to sides of an opinion i know i learn from those that disagree as well as agree..THank you stay blessed sweety.
I love DEELOVE. MAYBE TD JAKES DOESNT HAVE A 16 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER??? HE IS A LOT OLDER THAN PASTOR VERNON…I wish he could have put the party on TBN but knowing what they were trying to do, who would have seen it but a bunch of adults?? and they arent talking about TD because of this but baby they are talkn and i disagree with that too…have you heard of the book snakes in the pulpit?? he bashes them all. WHAT the devil meant for evil trust a believe God uses for good..Gotta make sure i capitalize all my C’s and G’s atleast…Bless you maam, love ya! (do we want to appeal to those that are saved or those in worldly places unsaved?) thats just a question not pertaing to the pastor or party..
imagezeverything, I am sorry to see that you have been brainwashed by “pastor” Vernon. He is proclaiming a false “prosperity” doctrine that is not the true Gospel of Jesus Christ.
It is not that he has nice things or a beautiful home or that he can give his daughter the material things that mean the most to their family. I don’t know how he got those things and it is not my business. He would never get a dime of my money anyway. If he is stealing from the church and taking what doesn’t belong to him, he will pay the consequences (it looks like the chickens may be coming home to roost!). My personal problem with this whole affair is that he and his precious, but not biological (why did he feel the need to reiterate that several times during the interview with Russ Parr??) daughter, felt the need to blatantly show off the things that he has acquired. His family is prideful and boastful while claiming to be a “humble servant of God”.
He and his family have brought shame on themselves and on the Church as a whole! You stated that this episode will appeal to those who are in worldly places, unsaved. What message did the show give to the unsaved?
For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more. Luke 12:48
@Imagezeverything,
Sweetie, you might NOT want to make any quotes referencing the book, “Snakes in the Pulpit.” Check out Lynn’s archives on that plagiarized scandal. I am totally unfamiliar with Pastor Vernon. It is still not my intent to undo any good deeds that he has done. In sticking with the subject at hand, you are going to have a hard time convincing people that his family’s participation with that MTV (of all outlets!) show was anywhere remotely Christian in nature. I have to agree with Just Lil Ole Me regarding their participation being an act of pride and boastfulness. I would think that most Christian parents would be trying to steer their children away from such worldly stations. I try to fight the good fight on my end with my teenagers. MTV promotes debauchery. Help me out with my thinking and show me what could possibly be construed as productive coming out of his daughter’s appearance on that show?? I guess I would just like to see more humility from our church leaders.
This will be my last time here because thru all this i have learned a lot abou self. Im not trying to convince anyone of anything i cant do that i simply state how i feel as you all do. I said what they initially set out to do could show people another side of havig fun and being saved could be helpful Pastor may not have made a good decision but it was his to make and his to own up to, this is a lot of people coming together to speak of negativity and that whether i go to the word or anywhere else is not in my up bringing i most certainly did fall into the trap but after leaving my cult today i was reminded that God is the only one with any vengance this is not my battle nor my pastors so whatever has or has not been done wil be handled byGOD… BRainwashing SAves im so happy to have had it done to me for the las 3 years is that better?? Still loving you all goodnight. Since so much is wrong pray for us at the word and dont leave out the pastor..
Pastor Vernon has done well for himself if he can afford a plane, party at the rock and roll hall of fame, and purchase everything his daughter ask for, certainly business is good.
However, were he has failed (so far) is in the training of his childs atitude. I’ve known children of wealty parents that dont have near the feeling of entitlement that she has shown on the show.
The nerve to have dance auditions(american idol stlye) for your party when you cant dance yourself. I would think that you would invite all your friends, not just the ones that can dance.
A FATHER SHOULD HAVE TOLD HER THAT.
Just because you can afford to have your daugther do a flyby, doesnt mean you should do it (no one could see her in the plane anyway). Rent a great limo and tell her she’ll still have fun.
A REASONABLE FATHER WOULD HAVE DONE THAT.
Mr.s Vernon let her daugther know that the scooters were expensive, even for one. But after the party she recieved 3 scooters. Now, the Vernons could have bought 20 scooters if they wanted too.
But truth be told, She has one butt, buy her ONE really nice scooter. Because in about a year shes going to be asking for a car.
A FATHER THINKING AHEAD WOULD HAVE DONE THAT.
If Vernon wants his daughters attitude to be closer to Christs than to Paris Hilton, I would suggest he make wiser choices.
I know many people think if you question a pastor, it means your attacking him. But I say if you dont question your pastor your open for attack.
Cop,
You beat me to the punch. I was planning to mention the three scooters. What was that about? The whole mentality of that party was inappropriate. The girl is buying friends at her father’s expense.
It was just the epitome of worldliness and nonsense. A total waste. And what lesson did he teach her? Not every woman is going to grow up to marry a rich man. If she is taught that because her father is rich, she can get whatever she wants and be “queen” of the house, what happens when and if she graduates college? Who is going to sustain her lifestyle? Or will the father continue supporting her expensive tastes.
Maybe some day her father will set her up in a business to sustain that lifestyle. For now, though, she has zero common sense. She actually thought that a plane could land in front of the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame. Her parents’ money would be better spent on giving her a good educational base—and some nutritional counseling for her health.
Oooo!! Lynnn (and some nutritional counseling for her health.) I wasnt going to go there.
I’ve been raised in the black church and have watched with interest the changes within the black church throughout the years. What we first have to understand is that the black church holds a more powerful position in the black community because of years of hardship and racial tensions that have also given this church a power that at times can be uncheck and lead to a path for the fleecing of many people.
THE BLACK CHURCHES INFLUENCE
For years before most blacks could afford, or venture downtown to the psychiatrists office, the black church served in this capacity. The black church has also been the marital councilor, the grief councilor, and community political representative as well as father figure to the largely single mother population within the black community. This has given the black church a die hard following that does not question the operation of the church because of its community importance and family structure.
SWEET SIXTEEN
This show of extravagance is just a rare glimpse into the life of just one of many pastors who has become the archetypical path to riches for many within the black community. Even though one can not discount the good that these men in pastor Vernon’s position do, it can also be noted that they perform a larger service for themselves. The Escalade with rims and the million dollar homes are opulent man made needs that we have generated in this “must have at least a McMansion” society. Should spreading the message of God be a path to riches and MTV fame? What would Jesus do? It has to be noted that Jesus preached the gospel with many followers, and yet he relied on the kindness of neighbors for shelter and walked from town to town. The temptations of immense wealth is not only a cost to the wealthy in sin, but also the pastors of churches as well (many pastors have fallen on the search for the all mighty dollar). Would Pastor Vernon be willing to reduce his lifestyle if it would help his flock? Even though pastors in our past lived in the same shanties of the old south with us during the civil rights movement, could these super rich pastors of today do more than give out book bags for the kids and financial advice? Is the image of their daughter kissing an expensive purse and her need to be seen an indicator of her parent’s values? The apple does not fall too far from the tree.
BOASTFULNESS
Let’s look at other signs of the egos behind the mega churches (especially concerning black America). Does anyone remember a time where there did not exist Bishops within the black Baptist and Nondenominational churches? Did we refer to the famous leader as Bishop Martin Luther King, or simply as Reverend? The title Bishop dates from early Rome growing to one that gave the leader of a large religious order (such as the Catholics) powers that were bestowed by the king (in other words, this man was the religious king). A new shift has grown within our churches within the past 30 years with the bishoping of any man that needs the title to justify his religious prowess. On almost every street corner, there exists a bishop. As one observer put in on the web, “this need exists as a marketing ploy because no self respecting pastor wants to be outdone by the other towns bishop.” In Cleveland there even exists a singing bishop performing shows around town. Where did this title come from? Where does one go to become a bishop? The conclusion has to be made that this is a self aggrandizing bestowment created to give the man a larger than life persona to his “flock”.
IN CONCLUSION
It has to be understood that every flock can be fleeced. The problem is that everyone is willing to cast a blind eye at the pastors because of the good they perform and the fatherly figure they maintain. For pastor Vernon, it was spoken many times from defenders that “he gets his money from his businesses.” What came first, the chicken or the egg? In other words, did he start out as a successful business man who started a church, or does his church direct willing followers to his cash cow businesses? I can answer that from experience (as an ex-member); during service (yes, during service) you could see commercials extolling you to visit the “Word” beauty salon, or the “Word” restaurant. Note to all readers, the “Word” is used as a marketing tool for those folks who have already been invested with their hearts in worshiping at The Word Church. Simply speaking, it does not take a business genius to grab a ready made audience and shift them over to your other money makers. This has been done in many less scrupulous operations in the past and will continue to be a tool for wealthy pastors in the future.
We as the black community will have to wake up and realize that it is our duty to respect and care of the black churches and their representatives, but not to make them rich. We also have to be careful that we don’t turn our own cultural self esteem issues into a ticket for our family in God to become rich because we feel it somehow makes us richer (how many times have you heard someone bragging about how big a house their pastor has). With the problems still within our communities, our money and financial assets will be better served investing in our own wealth and businesses and not the planes and purses of a spoiled pastor or Bishops child.
to M.C. or anyone else at the Word Church,
Can I just ask you all a question? When you gave your tithes and offerings to this church did you envision that this is where the money is going?
Do you have a problem with it?, I mean all that flaunting is your money.
@ nnod,
I certainly understand your question regarding the spending of the people’s tithes at this church, but I have to point out that the people who worship there will step onto sticky ground if they withhold their tithes. Correct me if I am wrong, but when we tithe we are doing so with the intention that we are giving the Lord back his share. If Pastor Vernon or any other Shepherd misuses the churches money, they will surely answer to God.
@Yusuf75
Thank you for an excellent and well stated commentary!
Yusuf, welcome to HickTown! You came in with a bang, indeed.
Lynn
I think first here I have to explain a little bit about tithing. When we tithe and give offerings we are not tithing to the pastor or any other figure in the church. We tithe as an act of trust and love to God. He doesn’t need our money because it Gus in the first place. That is our part as Christians. After that it is really out of our hands. Our act is recognized by God as an act of faith. That is were our role ends and the church begins. In biblical days this tithe was used to support the priest who worked in the temple because they had no other means to support themselves. Their work consumed them so much that if they had to deal with the everyday worries that the rest of Israel(churchmembers) had to deal with, very little wolf be done in the temple(church). You can see this example in neighborhoods were there are churches on every corner in drug infested areas. This are examples of churches where the congregation does not tithe or give offerrings. By nature being the pastor of a mega church there is more money involved when everyone is tithing. Our pastor is in a blessed position. POSITION! Thousand of members tithing in one place in WORSHIP to GOD. Biblically the system was set up that if you are the priest in the temple you receive the tithe as compensation for the work you do. What the priest(pastor) does with that money is his between him and God. And he is accountable for it. It is not our role to scrutinize and check over that account. If a pastor in this position is corrupt, especially in a mega church with so many souls involved than his punishment would be severe. Pastor Vernon is not that man. He is not a prosperity preacher. Sweet Sixteen may not have been a good decision in hindsight but his heart was in the right place!
M.C., to tithe and give money to a curupt or unwise church or Pastor is not being a good stewart over what God has given us.
You wouldnt give a hundred dollars to a crack addict, or a thousand to a 4 year old child. You would be wasting the money God has givin you stewartship over.
Tithing was used to help SUPPORT the priest, and provide for the needs of the widows, the fatherless, and those who couldnt provide for themselves.
Tithing shouldnt be used to fatten the wallets and provide extravigate materials for ANYONE INCLUDING THE PASTOR.
Looking at all of the businesses Vernon owns, it doesnt look like he needs anybodys money. If the church is still paying this man who seems to be independently wealthy, I would make sure every man women and child in that church wants for NOTHING.
M.C.
Being a prosperity preacher or not is not the issue, because if you are striving to live the same type of lifestyle – but without the title, then it’s still the same. The money taken in by the temple did indeed support the priest, but that priest had an obligation to God to use this money in a godly manner but was also held accountable to the peoples who gave that money. Remember that priest couldn’t even offer a sacrifice if unclean – and his financial stewardship was part of it.
I don’t know how well you know the word of God or if you were even in church (being a part of and studying) before the word church but the issue is one going about and establishing their own form of godliness and not taking into account the word of God. God wants us to tithe, that’s true, but God also tells us to know and to question where the money that you give goes.
2 Corinthians 8:20-21
20Avoiding this, that no man should blame us in this abundance which is administered by us:
21Providing for honest things, not only in the sight of the Lord, but also in the sight of men.
You do know that there is a federal investigation of these mega-church preachers don’t you? Do you why they are seeking the financial records? percentages, that’s what. They want to know how much of the money taken in goes to the pastor to support his lifestyle. That;s the real reason church books are closed. Creflo is fighting like mad to have the court issue a subpeana (sp) before he releases his books – you know why? because then his books would have to stay private by law – he don’t want you to see it, even if forced to show it to the courts.
If you mean to tell me that preacher (of which I am myself) has the godly right to:
start a church
declare it a non-profit
collect money in tithes and offerings
seek federal funding or private in addition to
take that money and create for profit businesses
openly solict his own flock to support it – all the while charging additional monies for it
take that money and put it in his pocket – even if he tithes off of it
and lives a multi-million dollar lifestyle
is biblical
-then the merchants who Christ ran out of the temple did nothing wrong because they were only helping people who had nothing to sacrifice.
All of the things about corupt pastors are true. But I state once again this is not one of them. The churches books are scrutinized and gone over yearly by accounting firms and certified tax accountants. They have found nothing wrong therefore the church keeps it’s non profit status. If that were the case than maybe your accusations of coruptness would have a place.
no offense, but legally wrong and bibically wrong are two different things.
Thank you for the welcom Lynn
What I am presenting to you should be required reading for everyone that faithfully distributes their money to the churches without a concern as to what the pastor is doing with their 10%. It must be understood that any pastor of a church would have a vested interest in keeping the myth of the 10% of you income alive. The truth of the matter is, we have been preached a gospel that has geared us all towards enrichment as apposed to religious sacrifice. {Click and read this: http://www.tentmaker.org/books/TheTitheisIllegal.html }
The bible and scholars of the past who wrote about tithing, never intended to imply that there existed a “church tax”. Actually you can take any scripture and alter it to fit into what would benefit you the most. In recent history the scriptures that seem to allude to a percentage has been preached on many sermons to induce the listener to feel less than heaven ready if they did not take 10% of their income and pass it to a man (and then look in the other direction). This is false and not what the bible teaches.
I know, I can hear you talking now “but the bible says clearly to pay 10%”. My question to you is who gave you your translation? Keep in mind that scholars are currently working to this very day to translate the bibles often cryptic language. Also, if you were the pastor of a large church that wanted to maintain your mansion, what translation would you choose? Taking your translation from the man who needs your money is like going to the car dealership to get your taxes done. You might get a certain amount of truth, but you’d better believe the truth will be slanted in his favor.
Let’s imagine for a minute that the bible in all its complexities was talking about giving 10% of food and land during the laws of Moses to a specific group. Let’s also say that this scripture: (Lev. 27:30-33) “And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD’s. It is holy to the LORD.” Could be taken and used to influence one to feel that they should give up money; however this scripture is specifically referencing land and produce. This was also during Mosaic law, but could be used to convince you who are living outside of that law, out of context, that you need to split part of your check because the pastor needs a new Benz. If you really wanted to be literal and follow the laws of Moses, put some seeds in the plate and see the pastor’s reaction.
Remember this one important thing; ignorance is a powerful ally to the strong. The preachers have a vested interest in translating the scriptures in a certain way. Part of it is ok (the survival of the church through financial means), and the other is not (self enrichment). Take a look at MTV and pastor Vernon’s plush lifestyle, or the 60 million dollars a year for Creflo Dollar and decide if God is blessing them, or are they blessing themselves at the expense of a poor congregation.
Man,
Exactly!!!
But they don’t tell you that part in some churches. The pastor tells of your obligation to the church but they don’t tell you of the church’s obligation to you.
The temple was obligated to help those in need and that included those who could not tithe as well
FIRST OF ALL, IF YOU ARE NOT A MEMBER OR HAVEN’T BEEN THERE, HOW CAN YOU SAY ANYTHING. I HAVE BEEN A MEMBER FOR 3 YEARS AND YES THERE ARE SOME THING I DON’T APPROVE OF BUT “NEWSFLASH”, HE’S HUMAN. EVEN THOUGH HE IS A MAN OF GOD HE MAKE MISTAKES. AND AS FOR HIS MONEY, IF THE AVERAGE CHURCH OPENS UP A DAYCARE(WHICH MOST DO)AND THEY HAVE ABOUT 200 MEMBERS IF “THE WORD” CHURCH HAS OVER 4,000 REGULAR EVERY SUNDAY MEMBERS THEN YOU HAVE MORE OPPORTUNITY TO OPEN MORE BUSINESSESS. AND IF YOU ARE THE CEO OF THESE COMPANIES OF COURSE YOU’RE GOING TO GET A CHECK. FURTHERMORE, WHEN HE GOES OUT OF TOWN TO SPEAK HE GETS PAID NICE AND THAT’S HIS MONEY. NOT TO MENTION THE AMOUNT OF CD’S AND DVD’S THAT SELL EVERY SUNDAY. LET ME ASK YOU HATERS THIS, IF YOU START ANY KIND OF COMPANY OR BUSINESS AND IT BRINGS IN 6-7 MILLION DOLLARS IN ONE YEAR HOW MUCH SHOULD THE FOUNDER AND HEAD OF THE ORGANIZATION GET????? EVEN IF HE GOT ONLY 5% HE STILL WOULD BE LIVING NICE. SO FOR YOU UNSAVED PEOPLE OUT THERE BEFORE YOU START TALKING KNOW WHAT YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT. OH YEAH ONE MORE THING, HE FLIPS HOUSES AND HAS GIVEN A COUPLE OF THEM AWAY(FULLY FURNISHED)RENT FREE FOR A YEAR. IT’S NOT HIS RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE EVERY MEMBER HAS MONEY. IT IS HIS RESPONSIBILITY TO PROVIDE THE AVENUE AND THE ACCESS TO HAVE MONEY AND WE HAVE THAT IN PLACE. AND FOR THE SAVED PEOPLE THAT STILL HATE ON HIM IF YOU ARE “REALLY” SAVED YOU WOULD PRAY FOR HIM IF YOU REALLY BELIEVE WHAT YOU HEAR AND SAY. “YOU MAY COME AS YOU ARE, BUT YOU WON’T STAY AS YOU ARE”
NOTE from Lynn Green: Please don’t use all caps. All caps signify yelling
Ajonesx3, I am member of the Word also and i am not suppose to be on this sight anymore because i recognize feelings will not change either way, I feel we have given many good examples as possible but get ready none of that matters, it is so much better to know than to try to prove….I know you have to be tired of the heated fellowship by now!! lol…HOw bout all the people who came to church to be nosey and wound up getting saved!!! AWSOME!!! overflow was in full effect…..GOd IS GOOD and with all this hate you know he’s gonna get GOODER and GOODER!!
EXACTLY imagezeverything. HIS PLAN WORKED NOT THE WAY HE WANTED BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY PEOPLE GOT SAVED. I KNOW I’M NOT SUPPOSED TO BE HERE EITHER. I GOOGLED HIS NAME AND THIS CAME UP. I NEVER HEARD OF IT BEFORE. BUT I HAVE TO DEFEND MY “DADDY” BECAUSE WE KNOW HE WON’T SAY ANYTHING AND THE ONLY REASON HE SPOKE UP WAS BECAUSE THEY ATTACKED HIS DAUGHTER. AND YOU SOUND LIKE PASTOR W/ THE GOODER AND GOODER!!(LOL) SEE YOU TONIGHT
Thank you fellow members of the “Word” Church. I was starting to think that I was the only one on this blog defending Pastor Vernon.
I cant speak for everyone, but I wasnt trying to ATTACK Vernon.
I just questioned the reason for allowing his daughters party, to mirror worldly ways and behavior on such a un-Godly show.
Iam sure Vernon does a lot of good work for his church, but it doesnt erase the attitude and lack of contentment in his daughters desires.
ajones3x
The Bible says to call KNOW MAN father(or Daddy). Matthew 23:9
He is not your father or Daddy, he is your pastor. (unless you are his biological daughter). Also, lets not assume everyone is unsaved because they disagree with the behaivor of Pastor Vernons child, or question his wealth in relation to his church.
AJonesx,
Please do not use all caps. All caps signify yelling and is rude. Also, all caps is very difficult to read. So if you choose to come back, use normal type. If you ignore this warning, your post will be removed.
Thanks,
Lynn
I did not assume that everyone saying something was unsaved. Read the whole thing I wrote and I had a message for the saved AND unsaved. The “Daddy” thing is a “Word Church” inside thing so non-members may not understand(amongst other things). And the person who said tithing is illegal, for something to be illegal it must be against the law (criminal or ethical). The 10 commandments were the 1st laws. Tithing is mention BEFORE the 10 commandments were written in Gen 28: 20-22. So if it was mentioned before law then……? Remember the people in the Bible didn’t have a bible for a reference like we do. They heard from God directly. And to address the sweet 16 and going on a station like that, in order to help dirty people (unsaved) sometime you have to get dirty yourself dirty. Why go on a religious station when most of the people are saved already. To be honest with you his plan didn’t work the way he wanted by saving people on MTV but more people came out to the church to be nosy and some of them got saved. So don’t be mad when a preacher does his job saving people. A lot of other pastors are comfortable and scared to expand because they don’t want to fail or have a backlash like this one. But if you go about your business right the only person you have to answer to is God.
P.S. I’m not calling unsaved people dirty, it was an analogy. I apologize ahead of time if I affended anyone.
Thanks very much Ajonesx3 for using lower case. I appreciate that.
Lynn
I am extremely surprised that this thread is still going! Word Church members, why are y’all so up in arms?? Most people are NOT attacking your pastor. They are merely expressing their disapproval over his daughter’s self-serving appearance on the Sweet Sixteen show. Stop skirting the issue and talk about the fact that she kissed her Louis purse and is self-absorbed. It sounds as if he is doing some good things in your community and for that I will give him his props. This Sweet Sixteen thing was not a good look.
Yes, this is probably the longest thread on this board at the moment. I hit a raw nerve. I need to do more of this type of article to rattle the cages of churches because it allows us to see what’s up with blind church members.
Uh ooh Lynn!! Here they come! LOL
I can see!! I can See!!! lol…But even as supporter i wonder why people keep bringin up old stuff??? I have yet to see anyone talking about the 80 year old pastor that had been coercing ladies in the congregation to have sex and lied under oath saying it was just the one lady when in fact he is the father of his nephew??? UGGGGHHHH!! is this not WRONG or does he have to be black because it sure was a Mega Church, and I still say to that God will take care of him….DeeLuv Sweet 16 i feel wasnt a bad idea but it didnt turn out to be a good one, i dont need to tell you this because you probably wouldnt care but when MTv was filming Pastor dropped the ball he should have been more hands on with her interviewshe wanswering,Im blessed being told by mtv give us somethingtoldomething i think as a child, a 16 yr old she thought about the show and reallywantd to be on it so here comes im a princess i get what i want, then further into the interview she still wasnt bringin it accordin to mtv she goes in moms closet and pics up the purse and said what she said this was probably not good but i think, as a mother i knw she really wanted her show to make it to tv…is it too far fetch to think she is capable of a little acting to better her chances?? like i said that wasnt right and maybe she just should have said well i dont want to be on the show but in her heart thats what she wanted. This girl doesnt represent at all what was seen on the show shes always nice and respecful, and unfortunately she got caught up, im sure its hard trying to live up to what folks think you should be because you father is a pastor but there are far more worse things she could be doing, am i right?? i have cousin thats a PK her father was our pastor coming up and boy she struuuuuuuuuuuuuuung OUT!! just like all of us we grow up to be individuals anyway daddy was a post man, carpenter of priest…Something tells me this one will be ok..Much LOve!!
OOH please excuse my horrid typing LONg day at workkk….
I have yet to see anyone talking about the 80 year old pastor that had been coercing ladies in the congregation to have sex and lied under oath saying it was just the one lady when in fact he is the father of his nephew???
Where have you been? I’ve been exposing Earl Paulk on this blog for months and just updated a few days ago.
Lynn
What I’m afraid no one is noticing here (and I’ve seen it for a while being around The Word Church and especially the women of The Word Church) is that there is a sort of cult atmosphere that has formed. One of your posters (ajonesx3) stated that calling this man “daddy” was a word church thing. What she (and I’m pretty sure it is she) isn’t saying is that there is a manic (as you can tell by the length of this message board) fanatical following of mostly largely disadvantaged and fatherless women who attend the church and actually worship and defend the pastor as a father figure to the detriment of honoring God himself. I once witnessed during a surface masses of people rushing to the front of the church to grab at Pastor Vernon’s feet. For me, who had read many books about the Jonestown massacre, it doesn’t take much to draw parallels.
1. Jim Jones started out as a dynamic preacher who attracted a large following – So have Pastor Vernon.
2. They referred to Jim Jones as father – As with Pastor Vernon
3. Dispite signs of Jim acquiring wealth uncheck, his people defended him to no end – Listen to any member of the Word Church.
One definition for a cult is as follows: Obsessive, especially faddish, devotion to or veneration for a person, principle, or thing.
When you find that you no longer can question your leadership and you only can focus on the good and ignore the bad; as well as putting man as the main focus of your devotion, you are showing signs of cult like behavior. God should be your focus and you should always be able to question the quickly growing wealth of those over you (especially when you remain poor).
Good observations as usual, Yusuf75
Lynn
His name is RA Vernon, not Jim Jones, so do you mean to tell me that any successful minister who does well for themselves and has a large following and love them is foul?? or a cult? SO if your pastor was blessed by God to have more followers and then have a larger church and do great things for your city, them you would run to the closest store front where there has been a bulding fun since the day you were born but still no new building?? Come on you compare lots of things dont make it so..Im sure we all have similarities to things that are not good and im sure there are many more comparisons where this came from but…….ok?….and…….if you look like a donkey does that make you one?? I can say on behalf of the Word Church members we know to Love God above all your children, mother, father, sis/brothers, things and most of all Pastor and if it isnt known it is often preached at the Word..I am not RA status but you can best believe I am being given the leadership as to how to get there with GOD and in the last 3 years I am in a better place and contiue to grow spiritually and financially, no Praise to Vernon,all praise to Jehovah Jireh!!! (My Provider) with much love and thanks for my Pastor because it is thru him that his Word is brought forth..you all would love it if we were a cult lol, that is so funny i guess at some point we will all lock ourselves in the church and drink kool-aid and kill ourselves too huh?? give me a break brothers and sisters you’re killin me….I have a mother and father how are you able to determine someone doesnt have a father in something they have typed its not that its a Word thing even Pastor refers to his own Bishop JOey Johnson as his Spiritual Father, i believe that is where that comes from is this the only place in the world where that term is used???? I know who my Father is Christ and my dads name is Joe, there is a sermon preached every year to the women and it happened to be called Daddy and His Dauhters ok and to some women this is the only father they have OH my goodness, no matter what evil will find some way to put his twist on things come visit, this is a national invite, see for self then speak on it…Tootles People!! we Word Church members Love YOU all!!
Calm Down, Imagezeverything!
It’s true that we don’t at all agree with your pastor and his choice to pay for his daughter’s extravagance. It was an ignorant move and quite ungodly. Three scooters is insane. What lesson is he teaching her?
You can’t make his behavior right.
Lynn
You are right Lynn i cant make his behavior right just like we can make anyones right that is passing judgement on him, all will have the same punishment..with 5 children do you think that lil girl is riding 3 scooters?? what if it was a sweet deal and it allowed enjoyment for the whole family?? im perfectly calm maam i guess when we read we put or own flavor to it lol. I am still simply stating my opinion as you all are im not mad im learning from a lot of this maybe not what you would like for me too but i have come across and enjoyed many of the comments. Do some strike a nerve? of course but i wouldnt be human im not gonna fight about it im sure whether some expect to or not they can take something away from something i have posted. lol you always think im agitated no its a great morning and i appreciate you the same as i appreciate my church fam…..i read all the comments and as long as i dont see those thing im where im at you feel me?? because it is about God and I listen to him when he speaks to me so I am safe at this point. so that is all he is the only one that can move me or change my mind….same goes for you.right?
Whoa, Whoa, Whoa. Lets’ get some things straight. How many of you people even live in this area first off all? Second, what are or have your pastors done to impact the city you live in. And I have addressed the sweet 16 but I will do it again. It was a bad idea;pastor has admitted that. But did you noticed she missed pronounced Louis Vitton (i think that’s how you spell it). Because they’re NOT hers. I graduated from broadcasting school 2 years ago. Let me tell you secret. Alot of those shows are fabricated. They tell the kids what to say if they’re not “entertaining” enough and alot of the radio personalities are taught to with opposite views of the majorities to get people to call in. Another secret it took MTV around 4 months to tape everything. Notice in the beginning when pastor was at home he had an afro and during the sequence when they show him preaching he didn’t. He went on a six week vacation and when he came back he cut his hair off as you see in the sequence. Therefore, I know for a fact they started taping in July and came back in October to get those shots of him without his hair. My points are MTV took advantage of the fact that he wasn’t in town and anyone that knows Lady Vernon can look at her face and tell that she did’t agree with the things Chanae was saying in the truck bit she let it go because of whta they wanted to do for their daughter. True he opened up Pandora’ box by doing this but he willing to deal with it. And I’m a 28 year old black male from the ‘hood who since joining 3 years ago has stop smoking weed, stop cussing and now owns a home. And since everyone know so much about him, what kind of vehicles does he own? Because if he wanted to floss i’m pretty sure they would have shown those and why did he buy her scooters instead of a car like everyone else gets even if they don’t have a licence?????
ImageisEverything,
You have one more time to roll up in here and make the type of remark about my blog that you just made (that I DELETED) and I’m banning you out of here.
AJonesx3, it’s spelled louisvuitton. And she bragged about having numerous bags. Keep in mind that each bag costs a minimum of $600.
The entire piece was ignorant. Simple as that. And I would not sit under such a pastor. But to each his own.
why?
Why, what?
You just made a really horrible insult against this blog. If you ever say something like that about me again (since I write this blog), I’m banning you out of here.
Since you claimed last week you were never coming back, I don’t imagine you would mind being banned, right?
If you think that while making lying accusations against me while saying “I love you” will work here, you are sourly mistaken.
Keep that kind of love, sister. It’s not welcome here.